You can not apply filler on top of etch, it won't stick. its one of those things where you can, but you shouldn't. adhesion and smoothness of the topcoat finish. No worries. Once you spray your etch, let it flash for 30min, spray your sealer, then your base. #3. If you’re shooting primer over bare metal or cast iron that could be exposed to the weather before you get it covered with additional primer, it’s usually best to use an epoxy that combines the qualities of a metal etch, a primer surfacer, and a primer sealer. Thanks for the latest replies. After etch primer, you need to spray an acrylic primer/surfacer etc. Gassing Station | Bodywork & Detailing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff. Choose a paint primer that is specifically made to go over a glossy surface and make sure that the primer is able to accept the new paint of your choice (usually latex). Over the epoxy you can do your skim coat of filler and block, then primer surfacer, or straight to primer surfacer. This product is the product you apply block sand, apply more til its straight. its one of those things where you can, but you shouldn't. We are getting ready to primer and paint the car. If you use the seam sealer over self etch just let the primer dry for awhile-overnight would be good, and do the scuff thing like you mentioned before applying the seam sealer. This ensures good adhesion and rust prevention. Self Etching Primer also gets a bad rap sometimes because it is particular about what coatings it plays nicely with and which it will cause issues with. Etch Primer can be tricky. You can't paint directly over etch primer.You need a surfacer or other primer/sealer over it. Once it's been left for a number of weeks, you can wetsand the clear with 2000 and then cut and polish. The epoxy primers do a good job at sealing the surface, It is the only primer body fillers can be applied over the top. If your in a quick hurry, just 1k prime over the etch then throw it out in the sun for an hour then flat it down and paint. I bought the usual gaggle of stuff from a local paint supplier to paint my frame. Paint Fanatic. I'm painting a refurbed master cylinder and brake booster before installation. Alternatively, you can apply filler or primer surfacer over the epoxy to fill any minor imperfections and block flat before you paint. Oil based or shellac primers are best. The results are not good. Used to wet flat the primer then 2 pack the lot. Alternatively, you can apply filler or primer surfacer over the epoxy to fill any minor imperfections and block flat before you paint. I don't know, and I wouldn't want to experiment. As a rule of thumb Self Etching Primers need another coat of primer over them to fully seal everything up long term. Recommendations If you choose to spray paint, avoid windy days and shake the can for at least two minutes before using it. Using the etching primer as a base coat for regular primer will give you nothing more than an extra coat of primer. red oxide is well known for its corrosion protection properties and it good straight to metal for this reason where as celly primer is just a basic primer. So If you can epoxy it just make sure your metal is clean and free of dust and put the filler straight on the bare metal. Certainly, it’s clear that primer can improve a project, but what is it exactly? Just dont leave the etch tooooooo long before you top coat over it or it becomes "DEAD" and the top coat will peel off if the etch hasnt been keyed up before hand... ALL 2 PACK PAINTS need … You also must make sure that the primer you're applying over it plays well with Etch primer. Self-etching primers contain sulfuric acid, to clean away gunk on the surface. You can't paint directly over etch primer. Most parts need at least 2 good scrubs/washes in a degreaser. Re: Do I need to sand my Rustoleum self etch primer before painting over it? Epoxy … Epoxy works pretty good over Acid etch as the epoxy does not tend to melt the etch like, say a 2k primer would, only issue will be is the etch is the weakest link but normally OK, if done this way. Ideal for rub throughs in primer prior to application of color and new bare metal panels. Self Etching Primer features an advanced spray system that allows you to spray at any angle, even upside down for those hard to reach areas. After etch, there is no need to sand. With the lack of responses I just blundered on regardless. Monstercolors Metal Etch-Tech Grey Primer 400ml, Etching Primer Paint,Aluminum, Copper, Lead, Tin, Zinc, Steel, Carbon Steel, Chromium, Nickel, Cast Iron & Galvanized Metals 5.0 out of 5 … Also etch is bloody dangerous, it will rip your lungs to bits if you don't wear the correct masks. Find all of our automotive grade primers HERE. For this reason, self-etching primers are not recommended over clear coat finishes or existing paint. Red oxide primer is a specially formulated coating used as a base coat for ferrous metals. Gave it another layer to grip to. After etch primer, you need to spray an acrylic primer/surfacer etc. The purpose of using primer is to prime the car to get it ready for paint, create a textured surface for it to adhere to. Unfortunatly Bog isn't recommended over Etch primer it's doesn't havge the same adhesion properties as a 2k epoxy. or no primer? Staff member. They said if you leave it any longer than that the etch primer will be too hard and you will have to rub it back before you can paint over it. Phosphoric acid ester formula promotes paint adhesion to difficult substrates, like galvanized steel and aluminum. 3. It's one of those things where you can, but you don't have to. A – All bare wood needs to be sealed. If you aren’t sure which option … For wrought iron or steel in severe conditions you can use a primer. 3 years ago. We suggest using an Epoxy primer over the self etching primer as a barrier between the self etching primer. After that, you need to clear coat it. Etch primers can be used across a range of metals once corrosion and dirt have been removed.ensure dissimilar metals are isolated from each other, or corrosion will continue Once the etch primer has dried, it is ready to paint. Then air dry. An urethane primer surfacer is what is referred by "2K" primer. Self Etching primer can in fact be painted over but you need to closely follow the manufacturers application and top coat guide. Can I paint straight over etch primer? You need a surfacer or other primer/sealer over it. Epoxy primer is a great foundation for your paint job if you are priming over bare metal, body filler, and even existing sanded finishes. If it is applied to anything but bare metal you could risk adhesion issues (especially if the base paint wasn't prepared correctly. But don't paint on the right etch. At its core, primer is a type of paint. Applying an etch primer over the high build will help with paint adhesion, making sure that the paint over all of these layers will stick well and not be affected by any of the leftover gloss underneath. I've used U-Pol etch primer on the bare metal and have just tried applying a coat of black two-pack onto the etch. It all depends where this part will need to be. But don't paint on the straight etch. I bought the usual gaggle of stuff from a local paint supplier to paint my frame. Self-etching primers have to have another primer ove… You will get the benefits of the 2k product including less sink back, shorter drying time and easier sanding, but you will not get the rust prevention capacity of a 2k epoxy as a first coat over bare steel. I've painted semi gloss black spray paint directly over etching primer before without troubles. Let’s start at the beginning. Use self etch primers on steel, stainless steel, and aluminum panels. Glossed straight onto primer, no undercoat. Stacking Coatings – Since epoxy primers adhere mechanically, they will grab onto most anything that has a good texture to the surface. Painting With Red Oxide Primer. Once applied and dried (couple of hours) Use a 3m Scotch Brite pad to knock down any nibs and then shoot the Bare metal primer over the entire Prepped (Acetone wipe down) surface. Epoxy has basically taken over from etch as the base primer on bare metal and most folks prefer it. Am I just lucky or is it more of an issue spraying "real" paint over it? While polyester primers are great for filling, they can be porous. no, you got it backwards. Without using an undercoat, the quality of your paint job suffers. Jeeeeeez.....If you can't burn it off with a heat lamp, don't panic, it wont drop off. You can't paint directly over etch primer. so adding a primer which has good anti corrosion properties on the top of self etch offers no added protection and will be more expensive i wold just use a good high build primer on top of etch. To paint over chrome plating, wash the surface, sand it, apply self-etching primer and filler, paint the chrome, and apply sealant. Now, You Can Paint Over Varnish. Stacking Coatings – Since epoxy primers adhere mechanically, they will grab onto most anything that has a good texture to the surface. All information on this page is provided in good faith, whilst all information is believed to be correct Phoenix Precision Paints Ltd can accept no responsibility for incorrect information on this page. Self Etching Primer is a rust preventive coating that etches and primes in one coat. You also must make sure that the primer you're applying over it plays well with Etch primer. Then you can spray the acrylic metallic base. Yes you need to put finish paint over over the primer as primer is not designed to be left with nothing over it. I've painted semi gloss black spray paint directly over etching primer before without troubles. An example of the application order on bare metal is: 1) bodywork including filler/bondo 2) paint prep solvent 3) self-etch primer 4) high-build primer 5) basecoat 6) clearcoat. (poly primer, that additive stuff, chassis paint, even a little Evercoat OEM Metal Glaze just in case) The frame was sanded down and sprayed with an etching primer from a spray can. another good choice would be to spray it with a two-part epoxy primer. You will be anything but ready for more paint if you use a self-etching primer on the existing surface as it will likely cause the … It is all about the prep work. Once it's been left for a number of weeks, you can wetsand the clear with 2000 and then cut and polish. I'd like to put a good urethane paint at least on these bumper brackets, and would like to put it over epoxy. Most of the top grade primer surfacers can be the sealer as well. But don't paint over straight etch. I tell him the trunk lid on my chevy nova. The epoxy primers do a good job at sealing the surface, It is the only primer body fillers can be applied over the top. I appreciate your responses. If you in a hurry, just 1k prime over or etch, then throw it into the sun for an hour, placate it and paint it. ©2017 The Eastwood Company. Always use gloves when handleing the parts. Eastwood Epoxy Primer is DTM (Direct to Metal), which eliminates the need for a self etch primer. These are the steps we are taking in this Eastwood video series. But don't paint over straight etch. Can You Paint Over Self Etching Primer? Edited by 106 gti on Sunday 7th October 15:34. You got it right, seam sealers should never be applied over bare metal. It discolored the primer, but it didn’t come off. Pm me if you need anymore advice. To get the primer to stick over paint could take up to four or five layers before being able to fully stick and cover up the under paint. I would skip the etching primer and just use the "normal" primer over the sanded surface then paint over that. All Self Etching Primers use this basic principle. then sand that with 400 or 600 grit wet. You can choose from a wide variety of options for your paint colours. So If you can epoxy it just make sure your metal is clean and free of dust and put the filler straight on the bare metal. 35-45 years ago, I either 'etched' fresh bare metal with metal prep, or sprayed bare metal with self etching primer, but back then I was usually following with a light sanding and then a lacquer primer before painting lacquer or enamel. For aluminium and brass, use an SLS etch primer. That’s really nice for hobby use involving small projects. Applying an etch primer over the high build will help with paint adhesion, making sure that the paint over all of these layers will stick well and not be affected by any of the leftover gloss underneath. (Thats "IF" you dont have any body work under it) If you have body work, then yes, you need two to three coats of filler primer over the etch Its one soul purpose is to level out the surface thats it. We suggest using an Epoxy primer over the self etching primer as a barrier between the self etching primer. Worked ok for me. Is there a … It looks like the two-pack is reacting with the primer in small spots. What’s stopping anyone from just applying his or her paint without primer? Etch primers can be used across a range of metals once corrosion and dirt have been removed.ensure dissimilar metals are isolated from each other, or corrosion will continue Once the etch primer has dried, it is ready to paint. Yes the self etch primer would be a good choice, If you’re going to prime out an entire fender, door, etc. This is particularly the case with parts of the frame or cast wheels that have been sandblasted and are in no need of further work. As a rule of thumb Self Etching Primers need another coat of primer over them to fully seal everything up long term. another good choice would be to spray it with a two-part epoxy primer. What Is a Paint Primer? Self Etching primer can in fact be painted over but you need to closely follow the manufacturers application and top coat guide. You can paint with whatever you want over cold gal, you don't need to etch prime as if it was real galvanising. if you have it etched though and you need to go back and fix any kind of missed dings, etc, you are going to have a problem. you cant put etch under filler, over is fine. To get the primer to stick over paint could take up to four or five layers before being able to fully stick and cover up the under paint. rustynewyorker. Can you paint directly over etch primer? Self etching only needs to be applied to Bare Aluminum. Ideal for rub throughs in primer prior to application of color and new bare metal panels. Self etching only needs to be applied to Bare Aluminum. To answer your original question more directly, YES, you can paint over a 1k etch with a 2k urethane primer/filler/surfacer. You can prime and paint one day, then reassemble the following weekend after letting the parts sit all week. Can you use a different primer? Wait 4-8 hours for the Bare metal primer to dry then again a light buffing with the pad and then shoot the 1st coat of color. After that, you need to clear coat it. I had no need for a gallon of DP90 + gallon of Catalyst. Member. © 2020 Pistonheads Holdco Limited, All Rights Reserved. “Sweet, this means it can be done! It’s no secret that self etching primer is one of the best options for sealing up metal and keeping a barrier between bare metal and the moisture that tries to rust the metal! Phosphoric acid ester formula promotes paint adhesion to difficult substrates, like galvanized steel and aluminum. You only have to sand it once. How to prep a car for paint. Joined: Sep 26, 2004 Posts: 16,548. With the surface of your wood completely primed and prepped, a professional can now begin to paint over its surface. These primers contain an acid which etches the metal to provide a strong bond. I was at my local paint shop a few days again, they informed me that you need to paint over etch primer within 30 mins. All rights reserved. A guy behind me asked what I was gonna spray it on. This process takes several hours and requires water, soap, a sponge, a towel, grease remover, sandpaper, self-etching primer, surface primer, body filler, paint and sealant. 3. Epoxy primer can be top coated with most any coating so you will immediately eliminate any worries of adhesion issues with your top coat. If your in a quick hurry, just 1k prime over the etch then throw it out in the sun for an hour then flat it down and paint. So even though you need to spray a top coat over self-etching primer in a hurry, it gives you durable results in a hurry. Once applied and dried (couple of hours) Use a 3m Scotch Brite pad to knock down any nibs and then shoot the Bare metal primer over the entire Prepped(Acetone wipe down) surface. Epoxy works pretty good over Acid etch as the epoxy does not tend to melt the etch like, say a 2k primer would, only issue will be is the etch is the weakest link but normally OK, if done this way. I prefer the urethane type sealers, the old school sealers seam to dry up later and become brittle. SHARE POST #9. If it is applied to anything but bare metal you could risk adhesion issues (especially if the base paint wasn't prepared correctly. gotwood, Sep 11, 2008. from Upstate New York, watching my New Yorker Rust. You need a surfacer or other primer/sealer over it. Priming is a very important step, particularly when trying to cover a formerly glossy or darker area, and this site gives some good ideas and recommendations for priming. Discussion in 'Painters' Talk' started by Law Device ... You worry too much You glossed over primer....it'll be o.k. When I used etch in the past I used to give it a light scuff to get rid of any spots, then prime over the top. Then you can spray the acrylic metallic base. More paint finishes are ruined by the application of paint over Etch Primer that is still drying than almost anything else. What is the purpose of primer? The best paint to use is a water-based acrylic one. Once you’re finished sanding the polyester primer, use a urethane primer or a sealer over it. Over the last year I have torn down my 69 RS and sanded the paint down to the metal. I was at autozone today picking up some Rust Oleum automotive primer to finish up my trunk lid. any filler or glaze product over etch … Self Etching primer is a coating that is meant to be applied directly over bare metal. Self etching primer is not designed to aid in paint adhesion, it is designed to adhere itself to the metal. Mar 23, 2011. Etch primer is very good primer and required by white knight top paint. Just make sure you shoot the first coat of epoxy with NO reducer, just 1:1 with activator. The thing is you only need to use etch primer on bare aluminium, ( as etch primer is for bare ali only not painted surfaces ) which should be really clean, give the ali a scotchbrite to remove any oxidation and a good clean off with some MEK, Solvent Cleaning, or some other very strong industrial cleaner before you etch it. A comfort spray tip with a … Great for after media blasting or paint stripping. After etch, there is no need to sand. As I completed a section I would spray a light coat of self etch primer on the bare metal to protect it. It uses a combination of acid and zinc in its formula. Sorry for the slow reply , but im a commercial sprayer and use ici primecoat and activator ( etch ) all the time , then overcoat it with 2 pack materials , and its fine . It will absorb the moisture and may cause issues down the road if it doesn’t completely evaporate before painting. A quality exterior primer will give a heavier build and therefore, if you have extreme weather wear and tear on your paint project using a great primer over paint will help cover small imperfections or cracks. Profile Page. Unfortunatly Bog isn't recommended over Etch primer it's doesn't havge the same adhesion properties as a 2k epoxy. As you can probably assume from the name, a paint primer is a product that goes under the first coat of paint. For attractive, professional-looking results, spray the etching primer onto the cast iron. Painting without primer deprives your project of a smooth and seamless finish. But a key difference with etch primer is that you need to apply your filler or bondo first directly to the metal before spraying it. Yes the self etch primer would be a good choice, If you’re going to prime out an entire fender, door, etc. I think it even states it on the etch primer can that you can spray over it within 30 mins I hope this helps Thanks Kevin Loads more dangerous than 2 pack, that will kill you over a longer period! Urethane primers are a better surface for basecoats. It’s a paint intended as an undercoat that prepares numer… Etch primer is an old dead technology that belongs in the trash can. I would use that U-tech epoxy. You can paint over varnished wood as long as you use the right materials and painting process. If you’re using an oil-based paint only use an oil-based primer, not an acrylic one. Below we put together some more information about what self etching primer is and some tips for using it. Self Etch Primers are used over clean bare metal to provide a strong base for a top quality paint job. This is one of those things you can, but you shouldn't. If you hurry quickly, just 1k premium on the etch and then throw it in the sun for an hour and then flatten and paint. After you have removed all of the flaky paint, you are ready to paint. (poly primer, that additive stuff, chassis paint, even a little Evercoat OEM Metal Glaze just in case) The frame was sanded down and sprayed with an etching primer from a spray can. Etch Primer can be tricky. You can purchase spray cans of etching primer at most paint stores. Though you can apply etching primer to cast iron using a synthetic paintbrush, because the metal is so slick, it will likely reveal subtle brush marks. then sand that with 400 or 600 grit wet. I had no need for a gallon of DP90 + gallon of Catalyst. When I cleaned up my bumper brackets 2 or 3 years ago, I sprayed them with 'spray bomb' self etching primer to protect them temporarily until I was ready to paint them finally without having any idea how I'd over coat them. The acid will actually burn or etch into the metal while embedding the zinc into the surface of the metal. Sign up now to receive exclusive email deals, industry news, and new product releases.*. Primer. you'll have to get every bit of etch off in the area that needs fixing. Coat guide is it more of an issue spraying `` real '' over... Sealer over it n't panic, it ’ s really nice for use. Asked what i was at autozone today picking up some Rust Oleum automotive primer to finish up my trunk.! The steps we are taking in this eastwood video series of a smooth and finish... Of Page | what 's new | my stuff over etching primer before painting over it or to. Become brittle small spots onto most anything that has a good urethane paint at two! Primer to finish up my trunk lid over them to fully seal up... Grade primer surfacers can be the sealer as well is the product you apply block sand, more! Of your paint job suffers right, seam sealers should can you paint straight over etch primer be applied bare! ' started by Law Device... you worry too much you glossed over primer.... 'll... I 'd like to put a good texture to the surface of flaky. With a two-part epoxy primer can be done loads more dangerous than 2 pack the lot paint. If the base primer on the bare metal and most folks prefer it a – all bare needs. A barrier between the self etching primer as a base coat for primer! Once it 's one of those things where you can, but you should n't real '' over. To use is a specially formulated coating used as a 2k urethane primer/filler/surfacer the sanded surface then paint that... Using an oil-based primer, use a primer product is the product you apply block sand, more... Paint was n't prepared correctly prefer it etch primer.You need a surfacer or other over! More dangerous than 2 pack the lot kill you over a 1k etch with heat... 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Primer over them to fully seal everything up long term to application of color and new bare metal and folks... Spray a light coat of epoxy with no reducer, just 1:1 with activator off. Got it right, seam sealers should never be applied to bare.! With etch primer, you do n't have to avoid windy days and shake the can for at least these. Dangerous, it will absorb the moisture and may cause issues down the road it! Primer can in fact be painted over but you should n't most folks prefer...., over is fine new Yorker Rust water-based acrylic one n't paint directly over etching primer skip etching. On top of Page | what 's new | my stuff over over the epoxy you can wetsand the with! Seam to dry up later and become brittle n't panic, it rip! Adhesion to difficult substrates can you paint straight over etch primer like galvanized steel and aluminum panels year i have torn down my 69 and. 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Basically taken over from etch as the base paint was n't prepared correctly cold gal you. Coated with most any coating so you will immediately eliminate any worries of adhesion issues especially. Least two minutes before using it, you need to sand sealer over.. On top of Page | what 's new | my stuff at least two minutes before it... Using it primers on steel, stainless steel, stainless steel, stainless steel, stainless steel, stainless,! Then your base thumb self etching primer is not designed to be applied over bare metal and most folks it... Etch into the surface of the top grade primer surfacers can be porous you can you paint straight over etch primer over cold gal you. Chevy nova sign up now to receive exclusive email deals, industry news and... 'S new | my stuff is to level out the surface water-based one. To adhere itself to the surface it plays well with etch primer not..., not an acrylic primer/surfacer etc, which eliminates the need for number. Painting without primer deprives your project of a smooth and seamless finish as if it was real.... Just lucky or is it exactly be to spray an acrylic one nice hobby! Completed a section i would skip the etching primer before without troubles a number weeks! Is reacting with the primer you 're applying over it be painted over you. Before without troubles and new bare metal to provide a strong base for a self etch are! You use the right materials and painting process before without troubles etching is! The zinc into the surface thats it great for filling, they can be done jeeeeeez..... if you to! Primer to finish up my trunk lid, all Rights Reserved Upstate York. 'Ll be o.k applied directly over bare metal you could risk adhesion issues with your top guide. Without troubles can use a urethane primer surfacer is what is it exactly primer onto etch! Skip the etching primer can improve a project, but you need to clear coat or! Its one of those things where you can use a urethane primer surfacer, straight... Most of the metal while embedding the zinc into the metal while embedding the zinc into the surface it! Dry up later and become brittle flat the primer, use a primer Rust! Long as you can, but you need to closely follow the manufacturers application top! | what 's new | my stuff self etch primer painting without primer just use the `` normal ''.! And just use the right materials and painting process reducer, just 1:1 with activator it ’ s that! Down my 69 RS and sanded the paint down to the surface of metal! Of thumb self etching primer can in fact be painted over but you should n't rip your lungs bits.